* Hillary Clinton THINKS she is the president.. she keeps on and on, dismissing the results of the 2016 election, and making statements about things that are none of her business as if she was president.
Now she is telling us about President Putin.
http://www.cnn.com/2017/10/15/politics/hillary-clinton-vladimir-putin-2016/index.html
Of course, Hillary's mouthpiece is CNN - the Clinton News Network.
Working with a foreign government to misinform the American people is one thing, but giving that foreign government access to private voter information would be a serious crime, that's what's meant when people allege there was some collusion. Do you understand that a foreign power knew highly detailed information about American citizens and it's not clear how they were able to access that information?….Mueller could find that the Obama administration made a serious error and caused detailed voter information to get in the hands of that foreign government for all we know.
...How did a foreign power get personal voter data? Were they helped? Was it something caused by the previous administration? If so, will someone from that administration be held responsible? I find it ridiculous that people are so dead set on looking over the fact that serious attempts at actually hacking into voting machines were made and that securing our elections is some kind of joke. It's not a joke; which is why both parties came together and called it out and passed new sanctions against that foreign government. It's why there has been hearing after hearing on this. This is an American problem, not a left vs. right problem.
Let's break this into several manageable chunks.
- Collusion vs conspiracy. You keep mentioning Muller. He is not interested in collusion but conspiracy, cover up, and if there was anything criminal done during the election that people on the Right were part of. Every time you misuse collusion you send a signal that you're paying attention to a partisan press.
If you want to understand what real collusion looks like check out what happens when a US senator steps out of bounds to influence Nicaragua.
http://www.nytimes.com/1984/04/20/us/congress-letter-to-nicaragua-dear-comandante.htmlOr think back to the collusion between Stalin and Roosevelt on the post-WWII world.
There's even the alleged collusion between then Senator Kennedy and the KGB to undermine Regan (unproven).
Collusion is not what Muller is actively investigating – Russia and Trump did not set out to divide the US for Russia to rule by proxy. Muller is investigating whether or not Team Trump actively sought out help to undermine Hillary AND if there would be any legal statues broken vis a vie whatever proof they might find.
Your phrasing in, "[d]o you understand that a foreign power knew highly detailed information about American citizens" gives me the impression that Russian intelligence was directly targeting individual US citizens. To be honest, I have no idea what you're trying to say here. I did a few Google searches and found nothing to hint at what you're implying.
Why aren't people more interested in this alleged story? Because the US has actively interfered with foreign governments, foreign government actively do this as well, and when you step back, the whole story looks like revenge for the Birther issue.
Every iteration of the US government actively tries to alter world politics. What do you think sanctions have been in Cuba, North Korea, Iran but a means to make the public rise against their leaders to pursue an agenda our elites prefer. Do and did Russia and China try to influence our elections? Absolutely. Did they? Sure, to a point. But they can only create fake news stories on Facebook. If the public has been conditioned over time to be believe everything they read and hear, that's neither collusion or conspiracy; it's stupidity, a wake-up call to teach people how to think critically.
From where I sit, people rallying around this idea of collusion are no different than those who maintained the birther (non) issue. And if you're a foreign person whose country has been affected by the US, you'd see a layer of irony on top of that.
For the sake of finding some common ground on this and moving on (since it's clear there's no intention to take a serious investigation seriously) I'll just say in conclusion, we will see what happens once the investigation ends. I've stated in my responses that nothing has yet been proven; therefore, I'm only going off of how guilty to president has been acting. I've also stated that if Mueller does not recommend charges, I believe everyone should let this go and move on. I've noticed for the past couple of months this has not been the main topic of news; healthcare and Hurricane relief have been, so the premise that this is all the left and MSM talks about is false anyway.
My only problem, like many others on the left, has been people like yourself dismissing a serious investigation that was launched almost unanimously by our elected officials of all parties and backed up by our intelligence agencies all to believe one president and his administration. If this administration knowingly aided a foreign power in obtaining personal voter data then they will be labeled as traitors. If this president has been involved in trying to cover up or obstruct any parts of the investigation, he should be held accountable. One thing's for sure, my "Lock Him Up" signature will remain until the investigation is over and no charges are recommended.
No, you are wrong. You have been pounding on this nothing burger of tax returns for over a year now. Trump did nothing wrong. There is no obligation to publish one's tax returns. Rachel Madcow did a much advertised special in which she ILLEGALLYbroadcast selected Trump tax returns (and didn't get punished for it). Your asinine photos on all of your messages shows Trump in prison. He hasn't even been CHARGED with anything. You haven't even suggested that Trump did anything that would put him in jail, yet you continue to do so. What you are doing falls under the category of libel / slander / defamation
Ohio State University has a student magazine which includes a flow chart to determine if your Halloween costume is racist or if it is OK.
Basically, if your costume attacks Trump in any way, then it is OK. (actually that is sedition).
also,
If you are white, then you are racist.
As was brutally demonstrated in Germany in WW2, if you can control what information the people have, you control THEM. Just ask Josef Goebbels.
China is currently controlling what their people hear - again - which is quite disturbing.
http://www.cnn.com/2017/10/15/asia/china-party-congress-internet-censorship/index.html
But.. what is far more horrifying than that is censorship in the USA.
Let me just start with the nonsense of the NFL players kneeling and Trump objecting to that. THAT is not censorship. Nobody is attempting to stop those players from saying or doing whatever they want OFF THE FIELD. Those players are just demonstrating that they can do whatever they want.. which is ironic, because in a football game, it is quite the opposite where all the players have to act not as individuals - but as a team that follows an extremely rehearsed and coordinated sequence of actions / plays.
The Internet in the USA is highly censored. The worst offenders are Youtube and Facebook - which selectively choose who to silence, and who to allow to disseminate and propagate not opinions, but outright LIES. They also indulge heavily in the lies of omission by silencing the truth! Really, what business does Facebook have to silence anybody? What's next? Yahoo and Gmail are going to start deleting email accounts of people they don't like? One can choose to block whoever they want to in email - but they can also do that with Facebook, so why do we need Facebook to block whom THEY choose to block? Also on Facebook, there are settings to allow only those who SUBSCRIBE to one's page to view the messages on that page. I have such a page which had over 500 members, and still has 400 members, but MY access to my OWN PAGE has been cut off! That is not only absurd, that is criminal on the part of Facebook. There are those that say "The TOS says.." well.. the TOS can say whatever they want, as long as what they say is legal. Once they say something illegal in their TOS, the entire TOS becomes invalid. One example of that. Facebook has demanded that I give them my full Social Security Number to re-gain access to my account. That is ILLEGAL! Only government agencies and financial institutions have the right to ask for your full social security number as a form of identification.
It is DANGEROUS to give out personal information that people have no business having. There are companies that get your information (Facebook) and sell that information to anybody who wants to pay for it - without your permission. I used to work for a software company that did exactly that as a sideline to make more money. Just YESTERDAY, someone managed to charge my paypal account for $18.53. The offender is "Skype Communications SARL" and is a well-known scam. I don't even use Skype.
https://www.paypal-community.com/t5/Archive/Skype-Communications-Sarl/td-p/986956?profile.language=en-gb
I got this email reply from Paypal when I disputed the charge:
Hello ,
Thanks for contacting us regarding the following PayPal claim.
Dispute Case ID: PP-D-5
Transaction Amount: $18.53 USD
Dispute Amount: $18.53 USD
Transaction ID: *****
Transaction Date: October 14, 2017
We Have Issued You a Provisional Credit
We have issued you a provisional credit in the amount of $18.53 USD. This credit should appear in your PayPal balance or your original method of payment within 24 to 48 hours. Please keep in mind that this credit could be debited if your claim is later denied.
Want to Cancel or View Your Claim Status?
If you would like to view the status of this claim or cancel it, you can do so by visiting the Resolution Center:
Log in to your PayPal account.
Select Resolution Center from the Help menu at the top of the page.
Click the Case ID under Resolution Center cases.
Click Cancel Case under Case actions you can take.
Thanks,
PayPal
–---------
The reason Facebook disables accounts, etc. is so that they can FORCE you to give them information such as your real name, address, cell phone numbers, social security numbers, associate names, etc. You don't think they sell that information? Then how do you account for the fact that Facebook now brings in $18 billion per year.. without selling anything other than your information to advertisers? Ever notice that whenever you purchase or even LOOK at something online, you start getting deluged with ads related to that product? That is because Facebook is allowed to not only collect your "cookies" but store them! Facebook is one of only a tiny number of companies that are permitted to do that. In fact.. they even ADMIT IT.. buried in their policies that 99.999% of people never see.
https://www.facebook.com/full_data_use_policy
What the fuck is wrong with Congress that they won't fix obvious and non controversial loopholes such as the one with insanity.
If there was a vote in the US, I'm sure that very few would support the current loophole.
I'm not sure why… it could be that it is difficult to designate who is insane, and how insane are they? There might also be a problem getting people to submit to psychological examinations if the person thought that they could lose their guns if they did so. i would suggest that an insane person is MORE likely to own a gun than a sane person.
Amazingly, Hillary is now attacking her own husband!
Blill Clinton sexually assaulted Monica Lewinsky in the Oval Office of the White House, including stuffing a cigar up Lewinsky's vagina!
This happened during Bill's first term, and apparently Hillary was outraged that Bill was won re-election!
I guess Hillary forgot about when SHE defended a man who raped a 12 year old girl, blamed HER for the rape, and laughed at her!
http://thefederalist.com/2016/10/11/rape-victim-hillary-clinton-laughed-blamed-getting-raped/
Colin Ferguson, Long Island Railroad shooter, was declared a nutter in New York, so he went to VA to get his guns.
Did they ever fix that loop hole? Declared legally insane in one state which bans you from owning a gun, but you could go to another state and get one?
I'm pretty sure they've never fixed that loophole. Both parties have been terrible on enforcing the current laws and creating ways to address the many loopholes. Some Democrats solution is to take guns away from law-abiding citizens and nearly every Republican is against creating legislation to restrict gun access to people who should not have them. I just think this is the new normal and everyone just has to rely on luck that they will not be shot while out of their homes. It sounds awful but special interests and the lobbyists are winning, especially now that the NRA and other groups like it are recognized as living breathing individuals that cannot be regulated on how much money and influence they can use on individual lawmakers. Corporations and special interests are individuals who have individual rights just like us; therefore, they have the same amount of influence as us, right? ::)
I would add that cops are among the LEAST law abiding citizens. They are given carte blanche to commit crimes. The classic example is a cop that beats the shit out of his wife but is never charged with a crime.
I think Trump could win in 2020, but I have my doubts that he will run again. He is already 71 years old That would likely mean Pence would be the Republican candidate. Who would you suggest for the democrat candidate?
By the way, what are your expectations about Mueller? How long should that investigation go on before it is ended? Mueller began his investigation 5 months ago.. and so far, nothing has come of it.
Anyone without 20+ years of Republican-based smearing attached to their name could beat #45 in a landslide because 2016 was never about him; it was political apathy and fatigue (caused by two unpopular candidates) felt by the millions who sat it out that got him his 77,000 spread across 3 states win. A young, enthusiastic Democratic candidate can fix that problem easily. However, if the president and the Republicans get their massive tax cuts and reform the tax system I do believe the market will become more stable than it has ever been because of corporate greed and it will increase his chances of finally becoming a popular president. That possibility can only happen if the president stays on message and doesn't self-sabotage tax reform the way he's done other major issues this year.
It is a very real investigation, so there's no telling how long it will go on. This is a complex problem and the fact that the president doesn't take a foreign power attacking our democracy seriously is still troubling. Millions of people may have voted for a president based on entirely fake information provided to them by what seemed like (to them) legitimate sources on social media. That part is troubling but nothing can be done by that except to hold platforms like Facebook and Twitter accountable for their parts in it. Collusion is the crime and if it occurred and can be proven, I think many people in the White House and people involved with #45's campaign that helped the foreign power target our citizens should be charged with treason. This investigation isn't going anywhere; therefore, calling it a nothing burger is pointless. When it's over and nothing is proven and no charges are recommended, that's when it can be officially deemed a nothing burger. I wouldn't bet on that though, grand juries don't tend to just pick up any case and grant warrants to the FBI to kick in former campaign managers' doors and raid their homes. Are you aware of what happened to Paul Manafort and what's going on with #45's campaign foreign adviser Carter Page?
Silly me.. I post a very short, very clear question, and get a mountain of jibber jabber as a response. In the Republican race - which you claim any other republican could beat Trump.. Trump beat out 16 other republicans by an avalanche.
Also, as always, no moonbat can name a single viable alternative to Trump.
As for Mueller and his ongoing nothing burger.. He has nothing, but will probably drag it out to try and prevent Trump from winning a 2nd term. The most ironic thing about Mueller's investigation is.. nothing he is investigating is even relevant! SO WHAT! Hillary DID 100 times worse than Trump is even accused of doing, and it didn't stop her.
This mentally ill guy shot his best friend that he lived with for 10 years thirteen times, and doesn't even remember doing it!
He owned a shotgun and a handgun. That is NUTS!
BOY Scouts are supposed to be for boys to be boys, like the Girl Scouts (Girl Guides in the UK) are supposed to be for girls to be girls.
Not surprisingly, only one group must be gender inclusive while the other is exempt form gender equality laws.
VMI had to become open to both, but schools that only allowed females didn't.
Penis only is sexist, vag only is equality.
While women and their cucks are trying to end male only golf clubs in the UK, they forget to tell you that 2/3rds of the single sex golf clubs are women only and growing. You will never hear feminists campaign for making ALL golf clubs gender neutral. NOPE, they only want to end male only ones.
Every day, Hillary's list of those who caused her to lose gets bigger.
Sadly, the crazy bitch hasn't realized that she is main cause. Hell, she believes she's the victim in all this and that she is totally innocent.
OI, BITCH. GET DOWN OFF THE CROSS, WINTER IS COMING AND I NEED THE FIRE WOOD.
You nailed that one EXACTLY.. Hillary is making a martyr of herself. She should win an academy award for being a drama queen.
It is possible that when Trump said "this is the calm before the storm.." he was referring to ISIS.
For the 2nd year in a row, the INCREASE in Antartic Ice has caused almost ALL the penguins chicks in Antartica to stave.
Fear not though.. the adult penguins are smart enough to move to warmer climates. Let's just hope that they don't run out of areas warm enough for their cute little chicks!
Al Gore.. failed presidential candidate.. failed marriage… successful penguin mass murderer.
http://www.cnn.com/2017/10/13/world/antarctica-penguin-chicks-die/index.html
Apparently, Bill and Hillary Clinton are no longer speaking to each other. I think Bill is tired of playing the role of being her protector. She would like Bill to rubber stamp everything she says or does.
Hillary should accept her loss and fade away. She is not fading away. She is still trying to sink her teeth into Trump's ass. That's a mistake. Now the pendulum is swinging back to bite HER in the ass.. for instance.. about that Tarmac scandal..
I know a few black people who voted for #45, but that doesn't change the very real fact that his supporters represent a very small percentage of this country. They are a small minority of voters.… That's the point I was making to counter you saying he's coming out stronger.
To answer your question, yes, I would be this adamant to see them if there weren't anything incriminating in them. Did you not read my first few posts
Morning.
Working bottom up, I did read your posts. I get the feeling that you don't want Donald Trump to be twice elected, is that a fair assumption? To that, it'd be better for you if his tax returns proved wrongdoing. The way you write about Trump assumes that there is something in his tax returns that would incriminate him. Therefore, I find it hard to believe that you would be as adamant for him to release his tax returns if you knew in your heart of hearts that there was nothing in them and that his releasing them would bolster his chances in 2020. That's what I mean.
Now you might be the rare enlightened soul on the left who truly wants bipartisanship and a kumbaya, but that is not how I read the posts I've seen. Either way, the bulk of the left wants those returns released because they're looking for a Gotchya! moment.
Trump's base, from what I've read, is 24% of the electorate. Not so small if those numbers are correct.
I'm a Clinton voter – not a supporter (I held my nose and did my duty). The moment the pink hats came out you all lost me, and that attitude which has kept you all on the sidelines protesting has continued to push me farther right. I represent the undecided voter. I speak with and know far more people like me who see Trump being bullied than I do the Never Trumpers. We don't necessarily like Trump but we respect the Office of the President, something we see as being disrespected.
Since no candidate has come up for the left's 2020 bid, it is way to early to call but whoever that person is, they're going to have to work really hard to earn my vote. The more people push things like taxes and Russia, the harder it's going to be. In this way, you're empowering Trump.
You may not believe me but I caution your party in how fervently they're opposing. 2020 might not go as you expect, just ask Hilary about 2016 for proof.
No, I do not want him to be reelected but that's not my main concern at the moment. I'm focused more on 2018 than 2020 because I believe the 2018 midterm will be a turning point no matter what happens. I have theories but I won't get deep into it because my posts have been too long already as is and it would be better to do with a separate topic. Also, we're still too far out from when I can match highly specific patterns between that upcoming election time period and previous midterm time periods. Next month's off-year elections will be the best place to start for that analysis. I will say this: Hillary Clinton was a highly unpopular, widely known candidate with 20+ years of negative publicity (self-inflicted more than half the time). Are you absolutely confident that there isn't some young, energetic, noncontroversial person out there who will be inspired to run and capture the support of enough people to give him a 365 electoral college victory?
Whether you believe I'm being genuine or not, I respect your view because it has no bearing on how I truly feel. I do think there's a strong possibility that he has severely misled the American people on many things and that the tax returns will prove that; however, I also believe there's very little chance that he's done something illegal such as criminally evading. As it has been stated, the IRS would have acted on anything illegal prior to him being sworn in as president unless they themselves are complicit (very unlikely). It will all come down to what Mueller recommends after the investigation is over. When that time comes, I would hope all of the left would move on if there's no there there. Saying there's no there there while there's an open investigation is a bit premature. However, if something serious is there and charges are recommended, it would be highly important to explain why those charges are being recommended. I think he should get a court order to release the returns in that instance to shut down the "fake news" shouting we'll most likely hear, or he should at least be allowed to explain what he found in the returns and how it plays a role in the possible collusion with a foreign power to attack our democracy.
I think Trump could win in 2020, but I have my doubts that he will run again. He is already 71 years old That would likely mean Pence would be the Republican candidate. Who would you suggest for the democrat candidate?
By the way, what are your expectations about Mueller? How long should that investigation go on before it is ended? Mueller began his investigation 5 months ago.. and so far, nothing has come of it.
You may have noticed that the remaining gang of moonbats that didn't get themselves banned stopped posting for about a month or two.. then suddenly all of them started posting again on the same day - a lot.
But then they all suddenly ceased posting at the same time, in a blatantly coordinated action… right after complaining that they can't make more reports.
It seems that they are CRYING.. :cry2:
Unless they are able to post a litany of false, malicious attacks upon Trump without incurring any response to their garbage, they are not happy.
@Icc:
Fredrick, this is rude. :spank2:
RC, you should have ignored it. :spank:
you're acting no better than two tranny queens fighting for a hit off a crack pipe.
:rotfl: :clap2:
For realze!!!! I lurk but don't post cuz you queens just bitch, bitch, bitch.
WhatEVERRR!
It's not just that.. the POTUS was in the middle of an interview when he was interrupted by some idiot who played the "Retreat" recording. That was no accident.
Possibly, but that's speculation.
One of my best friends from uni (now) believes in bigfoot. (sigh) We can mistake all kinds of things for causation and come to the wrong conclusions. Me? Just the facts. This kind of stuff is delicate and needs to stop.
Some of the bigfoot stuff is non-native orangutans that have gotten into the wild. They were someone's pet or escaped from a zoo.
As for Trump, the media seem to be ignoring the story of the interrupted interview… so it was just one moonbat report that one of our resident moonbats is hanging onto like a dingle berry. The rest of the media are making up some other fake news.
You were not here several months ago when the moniker battle was going on. The moonbats were tearing into Trump…. Finally I suggested several words myself, and "moonbat" got approved.
Ah, I get it now.
Anyone coming into these forums wouldn't know that, you know.
We are a community where the young are often a little damaged. If they come here and see lots of name calling, especially when they don't know the history, they're going to come away with an unfavorable impression. We are, all of us, capable of creating and maintaining a good impression.
Never Trumpers I think is easy for an outsider to understand.
Don't you all think it's time to put away the baggage from the 2016 election, anyway? The media is going to foist the 2020 elections on us soon enough. It'd be nice to clear the slate and start fresh.
I expected the divisive attacks to END once the election was over, but if anything, they INTENSIFIED! The left won't let it go. Hillary is still trying to have the election results rejected as recently as a week ago. There are media and celebrities calling for Trump to be impeached and assassinated to this very day. These wingnuts need to be silenced because they are behaving like petulant children. Kathy Griffin is trying to reboot her career with brand new attacks on Trump.
President Trump sat and talked through the nightly playing of "Retreat" as the American flag was lowered on a Pennsylvania Air National Guard base during his interview with Sean Hannity.
So the question is whether an NFL player kneeling in protest during the National Anthem is one and the same with POTUS speaking during Retreat.
Not the same.
The protests are a willing disregard of the custom meant to shine a light on a cause they believe in. The President either didn't know he was expected to stand, or as the President isn't expected to stand and there is no hidden meaning.
I get it. Some people hate Trump. Those that do will make false equivalencies. Unfortunately, all this does is pump up one side with faulty reasoning while making the other side come to Trump's defense. In other words, it's divisive.
It's not just that.. the POTUS was in the middle of an interview when he was interrupted by some idiot who played the "Retreat" recording. That was no accident.