Gay men and politics view
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I am just interested in how gay people around the world think about their countries' law systems and politicians. Do you voter for a politician who promise that he/she would support gay rights?
I really don't think that he/she will do anything he/she promised but among many candidates, I'll pick the one who support my rights. Unfortunately, in my country, no politician has ever declared that he/she'd support gay rights. And being gay is still a taboo here (although it's not forbidden). -
I personally feel that USA politics is full of crap…but I vote for the less evil of the candidates...which meand democrat..can't find one good thing froma republican...
right now i'm still undecided about hillary and barack...
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Are Derek and I the only who care about politics here?
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A lot of people view public discussions about politics and religion as taboo.
I know gay people who will never vote for anyone who supports gay rights. They have various reasons for this, some are gay and ashamed and some just don't want gay marriage, so they can justify their whoring around.
I have in the past voted for people that were against gay rights because they were good at other things that needed doing for the nation. Former Sen D'Amato {R - NY} was against equal rights, but he was the only hope the US had in fighting the banks and he regularly spanked them in Congress. With him gone, there is no one to protect us from those evil money grubbing bastards any more.
I also won't vote for a 1 trick pony who bring nothing else to the gov.
In a perfect world, I wouldn't have to care about the issue of equal rights for gays.
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well i do not believe in any marriage..so thats not the issue…for me..but some kind of tolerance towards gays its necessary for me..and republicans..will never reach that level...atleast not anytime soon..
even if a candidate may have great ideas for the country..how its that going to help me..if i'm not consider part of the country because i'm gay...
but as i said before..all politicians are full of shit..LOL
the one candidate i liked (John Edwards)..its no longer running..so its all a matter of waiting to see who wins the primaries...
but its true no one like talking about politics..or religion..cause no matter what anyone says...their way of thinking will never change..we are all stuborn that way..LOL
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Whoever said politics (especially US politics) is full of it, is right. Why they just can't get ON WITH IT down there. They have the good guys fighting the good guys (democrats). Here, you have the best chance since confederation, or whatever you guys call it when you broke from England; a choice between a black and a woman and you have them fighting. Those republicans will just be able to pick up the pieces.
I wonder if Ben Franklin intended all this primary stuff. Why can't the caucus' just get together for a weekend like we do, and get the thing over privately? OK, ours is televised, but you only see the surface, not the infighting.
Hillary is the only one that can give that country universal medicine. The US is the only G8 country without it. Instead, a trillion dollars is spent in Iraq. Which makes me wonder about the American people. Electing Bush once could be an honest mistake. But TWICE?!!!
And AFTER the election, you NEVER see what is going on in Congress. The proceedings are not televised. And you CAN'T get rid of a president in the middle of a term without impeachment. Last was Nixon. We can rid of a government ANYTIME with a non confidence vote.
Poor old Ben must be turning in his grave. I have been to Philly, saw the 'sunrise' chair, liberty bell and all that… He even turn to the Magna Charta to try and get it right, with a balance of power, fairness etc.There is a copy from 1387 RIGHT THERE in Philly. And yes, he even wrote a doc against slavery. And BTW, the US was the LAST country to quit slavery, and took Abe and a civil war to do it.
You want some one else to talk politics, well that's my piece.
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Oh, and another thing. You ask about gay rights? We have had spouse rights for at least 10 years and gay marriage for 5. So does the Netherlands and several other European countries.
And we have had a Charter of Rights since 1985 that guarantees protection against discrimination based on sexual orientation. And some guys down there want to BAN gay marriage in the constitution?!!
And of course, since 9/11, the paranoia down there is unreal. Pearl Harbour was far worse, anyway. And you fought two wars simultaneously and cleaned it up in 6 years. Bush has had the same and has only made the US more unpopular in the world. There is a LOT riding on this next election.
Having said all this, it is incredible that a place like California and Hollywood exists. They turn out the most incredible free thinkers and are a beacon for the world. And a vanguard. Not to mention many of your famous universities.
Where are all the protesters, as in the Vietnam war?
One of the reasons gays are not liked is we appear to be so hedonistic. This is partly true. Maybe its the generation, or maybe its that they are too shut out, at least if they are out. Whatever; I like that people are standing up for their rights.
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Bush first win was thru the Supreme Court…and the Second was based in fear...
you know why we do not protest as much..cause the protesters of the 70s and 80s are still in control of that..and they are all sell outs..LOL
i deal with alot of gay issues here...but the older generations..seems to be stuck on one thing and one thing only gay marriage..and they believe things can only be resolved with lobbying...
they automatically think that a protest a rally will get violent...they do not want to pass the torch the the younger activists...so as a young gay male..i spend my time fighting with the older gays...to be part of the community..it gets old...LOL...and exhausting...
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Hi
I've read a very good piece of advice in a COMIC book long time ago….
Now imagine you are NOT into scat in any way, shape or form, and someone offers you several plates full of shit.
Which one would you eat?
Voting for politicians/political parties is the same. No matter who/what you vote for, the taxes will go up, wars will be fought and nobody cares for you.
I myself? As left as anyhow possible. Been member of the communist party in Germany, actually. Still a commie by heart. But in this country i can't vote because i'm a foreigner (i live in Thailand now) and here we have the same political alternatives as above - i.e. a number of plates filled with shit. My boyfriend votes for the smallest available party which is guaranteed not to get anywhere, just to make sure none of the big ones gets his vote and he still done his duty as a Thai citizen.
Best regards.....
Thanh
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ThanhBKK you are right all politicians are full of shit…
but until mr perfect man in politics comes around..we have to choose someone...
and as best as i can i choose the less evil of the bunch..LOL
i have to vote so i can bitch about things...otherwise....i don't vote i can't bitch..LMAO...
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I think if every minority stops focusing on their own individual rights, and gets the subject right, "Human" rights, things among gays and other groups would be more accepted. By constantly putting the gay community out there in this way divides it more and more. Why should you have special rights just because you suck dick ? That is a very simple way to look at it. Why should you have special rights just because you sleep with women ? We all need the same. But it is always campaigned for in a very negative way. I will support a candidate that will show he or she will focus on the health, well being, and security of my country as a whole, not just what they are going to do for me because I happen to be gay. Hillary Clinton here will do fine. It will be nice to see them back in the White House.
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The problem is that conservatives claim we want special rights, when in fact we want the same rights they have. I have yet to hear a GLBT person want "special rights" everyone I know wants equal rights.
The current situation in most countries is that heteros have the special rights; ie rights not granted to all.
Even in the UK with civil unions, we still don't have all the rights of hetero marriage, like work and personal pensions. Tony Blair called civil unions "separate but not equal" to marriage. Of course his backers said it was a slip of the tongue, but the result showed how really meant it.
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Well in the UK I tend to vote where I think my rights as a gay person are most protected.
It is on the record that over 50% of Conservatives did not want the Civil Partnership, and believe it should be repealed. There are a large number among the part who feel that homosexuality should be recriminalised. - Very unlikely to get my vote!
I personally feel that under the premiership of Tony Blair the labour party has brought about some of the most significant advances in the protection of gays and as such makes the UK one of the better places to be gay under the law. I will continue to vote for labour until I think that there is a change in the tide.
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Are Derek and I the only who care about politics here?
No - but i think the truth about Politics is so complex , many people have difficulty formulating ideas about their feelings or their knowledge about it…..
I think politics is a necessary evil -
I think politics is corrupt - power is corrupting and you can never get away from that.
I think politics is a cultural contradicition - On the one hand it is the hand that wields so much horror and misery but on the other it is the vehicle by which humans gain their worldly hopes and freedoms and by which human history progressess through time.I think it's healthy for an individual to work out a personal relationship to ethics, but i acknowledge that people are loyal to abstract and spiritual positions often via deep and irrational impulses rather than well thought through logical notions. This is why i love an ethically thoughtful man - i see it as the sign of a real 'man' - how he handles ethics. I also think the mysterious,deep and illogical exists in life - and not all things can be broken down to ethical and politically framed ideas.
I think all moral choices are best considered via one of politcal ethics. I think that approach shows an awareness and consideration of other people at it's best and also an awareness of the implication of human behaviour and events and that to me is the mark of wisdom.
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Well, I agree that politics is complicated, but it is not so evil. At least it is about governing, organizing, and administrative stuff. Not every man is so innocent and self discipline that we don't need any authority. We have criminals, bad guys, or at least we need some people to start building railways and roads!
Are Derek and I the only who care about politics here?
No - but i think the truth about Politics is so complex , many people have difficulty formulating ideas about their feelings or their knowledge about it…..
I think politics is a necessary evil -
I think politics is corrupt - power is corrupting and you can never get away from that.
I think politics is a cultural contradicition - On the one hand it is the hand that wields so much horror and misery but on the other it is the vehicle by which humans gain their worldly hopes and freedoms and by which human history progressess through time.I think it's healthy for an individual to work out a personal relationship to ethics, but i acknowledge that people are loyal to abstract and spiritual positions often via deep and irrational impulses rather than well thought through logical notions. This is why i love an ethically thoughtful man - i see it as the sign of a real 'man' - how he handles ethics. I also think the mysterious,deep and illogical exists in life - and not all things can be broken down to ethical and politically framed ideas.
I think all moral choices are best considered via one of politcal ethics. I think that approach shows an awareness and consideration of other people at it's best and also an awareness of the implication of human behaviour and events and that to me is the mark of wisdom.
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I consider myself to be blessed to live in the Netherlands where gay marriages are a common thing. Our political system is a bit f*cked up as we have way too many political parties to choose from. However most of those parties are quite liberal and protective of the gayrights. (with the exception of 2 smaller "Christian" parties)
However, last few years even in The Netherlands and especially Amsterdam, gays have been under attack a lot more than they used to be. I am sprry to say that it is mostly the second and third generation of immigrant muslims that do so. Gaybashing and discrimination of gay people has risen spectacularly over the last 4 years. Which I found odd, as the especially the gay community in NL is always welcoming and open minded towards new cultures brought to our melting pot of nationalities.
I try to vote at least for a social-liberal party every 4 years. One thats there for the sick and the needy, for the elderly and for the gay people as well. Does it make a change? …. We'll never know... What we do know is that not voting will only benefit the bigger leading parties... So vote! Is all I can say.
SPUNKSTA
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Being Dutch, I think I'm off pretty well. Spunksta is right about that. But concerning politics, I really think we suck.
Right now, from what I can say, Norway is the best country in the world.
Basically I'm an Oligarchic Republican. I don't 'believe' in Democracy and I certainly don't believe in the Dutch version of the term. I do always vote, I tell my friends and others around me that people who vote have the right to bitch about politics. If you don't vote, you don't get to complain. Right now the Netherlands is without a government, not that we're noticing any difference; we'll soon get to vote for a new one. I'm hoping for a red(-ish) outcome, but we'll probably either get stuck with centrist capitalists or that Geert Wilders figure.
The Socialist Party, of which I've been a member for a while (not anymore), is currently under strain of losing the replacement head of the party. The founder was immensely popular, but ever since he left the party has been losing voters. I saw the new guy who is to chair the party - he is ugly… The other social-ish party is too centrist to do any good, but at least it is a veteran party with plenty of voters. They too will be getting a new chair, since the current (Wouter Bos) is being spit out by the majority of people here for screwing us as minister of finance.
Anyway, I'm in no position to break the system, so I abide and try to make the best of it through this unfortunate but 'functioning' system.
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UK here. There is a General Election looming and the 3 main national political parties are generally 'gay friendly', so there is not an issue in that department. With the economy screwed, cuts in public services, inevitable tax rises, the news full of ludicriously lenient sentencing of criminals … there are many every day issues that concern me more. But that just makes me more thankful that I live where I do, and not somewhere that gays don't have rights or even worse.
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While none of the 3 main parties aren't screaming for our blood, they aren't exactly "gay friendly".
There is still a vast amount of injustice under the law and by the way the law is enforced.
Here are some examples;
1. Married hetero couples are guaranteed the right that both of them are placed in the same old folks home and get the same room. Civil unioned gay couples are not guaranteed any of this.
2. While both married and civil unioned couples get their partner's/spouse's state pension upon the death of the other, only married heteros have the guaranteed right to their spouse's work and private pension. Some banks and businesses are now including it in their contracts, but this is few ad far between.
3. Immigration rules are similar, not the same for hetero and gay couples.
The list could go on forever of the "separate and not equal" that Tony Blair talked about.
We had "U R A GAY BOY!!!" spray painted on our house 2 weeks before this past christmas and it took the police 11 days to show up to take a police report. They came that soon because we kept complaining that they were taking so long. Our Pakistani neighbors had "Paki scum" spray painted on their house over the summer and the police arrived within the hour of it being reported. The council removed the graffiti from both houses. Theirs was removed the same day, while ours took almost a month. The had theirs removed for free and we had to pay £836.
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I wouldn't vote for him solely on the basis of his verbal show of support for gay rights. I will, however, vote for him if he is consistently displaying a mind of his own and not just what the rest of his party are saying. This means he will attempt to look at each question from different perspectives before making his stand.
Here in our country, we see gays everywhere (literally) but it's still kind of taboo in conservative families. And the reputation of gays is terrible.
